[Date Prev][Date Next] [Thread Prev][Thread Next] [Date Index] [Thread Index]

Re: vrweb, newbie maintainer/developer

On Mon, Sep 27, 1999 at 02:03:06PM +0800, Paul Harris wrote:
> let me know if these mails are overloading the rest of you mentor
> subscribers, i'm not sure what emails should be send private or public
> yet...

Send it privately to me. Most attachment aren't good for mailing list,
especially if it's just need for a few people. People who are interested
can always trying your web site or asking you to send them a copy.

So, send it to fab@tzone.org please :)

>
> ok but i was curious: the only thing i can't change is the copyright?
> it should have your name on it always right (debianized by: ____)

Near right. I don't put any condition over those scripts. So, it's just
like I included it under the whole licence of the package, the GPL. You
have to keep my name as the author of the scripts but you can add your
own under the modifications you make (in fact, the GPL ask you to do
it). And, for sure, you have to preserve the licence of the upstream
maintainers ;)

>
> yeah, thats why i won't bother helping with the Harmony transition...
> seems like a lot of work for a VRML viewer!

Yes, especially with Harmony not going under heavy development either.
However, my first goal was to dynamically linked it with the mesa
library which always improve. It's a big package and it will be useful
to push it out of vrweb. Maybe one day I'll send you a patch for it...
;)

>
> there were times where i would wish that the new-maintainer or
> developer docs would cover more stuff, from simple stuff like: who
> do i contact? i had to be pointed to the debian-mentors list by
> a developer... i don't think there is any mention of them in the
> new-maintainers doc. .. to come complex stuff like "what happens when
> a debian helper won't work, or what to do when stuff like the wrong
> type of whitespace in changelog won't let the package build, or what
> to do when the examples docs won't install (because they need to be in
> the examples dir, which is installed with the docs file but they don't
> mention that it installs stuff relative to the bottom path, what do
> you do when you want another path installed by make it look like it
> was in the parent dir?)
>
> phew that was just something off the top of my head, but i hope you
> get the picture. i should have written down what my problems were so i
> could be more specific, but i just played with it until it worked...
> i kinda wish linux was more idiot proof so i didn't have to know
> programs inside out to get things to work :/

Oh well, that's really fall under the tips 'n tricks of unix
programming. Especially, most of you concern is about bug in the devel
packages, a little bit stupid to document them without fixing them. I
agree that a mention of the mentors list should be clearly made but we
can't talk to loudly about the debhelper scripts: it's just a tools and
the guidelines doesn't enforce their use (we already have three of such
tools: debmake, debhelper and yada).

I think that including a link to debian-mentors most be the only thing
we can do. Other mileage can vary. And, about the bottom path, take a
look at chroot. The libtricks package is also useful.

> >
> > OK. I'll have to put my name under it however because it's my PGP
> > signature who'll be checked. When you'll get your account as a
> > maintainer, you can upload a new version with the right maintainer
> > on it. [It'll be not too big cause only the patch, dsc and changes
> > need to be upload, the original source files doesn't because it
> > doesn't change.]
>
> ok. can you please make the changes? this is where the scripts gave me
> problems.

Which changes do you talk about? Are you talking about your patches or
about what's need to be change for the upload? I think I'll understand
better when you'll send me the patches.

>
> i think i did use the debhelper scripts. i was having problems so i
> redid all the files with the help of some scripts, although which ever
> one makes changes to the changelog file stuffed up.

oups! I think it's about those one. dpkg-changelog is supposed to do
the trick. At least, your extract seems ok to me (maybe this is just a
question of spaces and tabs).

> >
> > You have to send it to the new maintainer when it'll be sign by
> > Dave.
>
> i still haven't heard from Dave.

Wait a little since moving can keep people quite busy ;) But having your
key sign by another maintainer is always better.

> > So, first, have you read the Debian Social Contract (if not, do it
> > ;)? Do you understand it? What do you think about it? I'll be please
> > to answer any questions about it.
>
> yes and i agree with it.
>
> > What's your future goals with Debian? Do you want to participate
> > more actively to Debian, push up more packages or simply maintain
> > your current package?
>
> i want to improve debian by "expecting only what I put in", or
> contributing. I needed vrweb for a project and didn't work. So I fixed
> it. I love that "feature" of Linux and have become the maintainer
> because I feel I can do the job. I probably won't use vrweb much, but
> my goal with vrweb is to keep it working... i don't forsee another
> release of vrweb anyway.
>
> now, i am looking for more packages to support. i won't support a
> package for the sake of being a maintainer, i have to use the program.
>
> I am currently looking at xldlas, a statistics program that may be
> removed soon because of license problems (i'll talk to -devel about
> that). i saw it on the orphaned list, checked it out and found it
> useful for my future project :) i also want to fix those segfaults
> that occasionally pop up.

That the way I started. So I can't disagree ;) Good luck with
xldlas. License things are always "delicate" (that's a word for word
translation, not sure if it's the right expression). Ask for some help
on debian-legal if you feel it.

>
> > What I really want here is to present you the opportunities of
> > Debian. Working for Debian isn't just packaging some cool software.
> > It can be really more than that, and most of the stuff is even more
> > exciting than package maintenance.
>
> i'd like to get involved with that stuff, but i think i'll slowly
> increase my involvement rather than dive-bombing the rest of you in
> the deep end of development (so to speak).

I agree with you. Maintain a few good packages rather than many medium
one.

>
> > I also want you to know that your job as a package maintainer isn't
> > finish when you upload your package. You have to support it after
> > that (that's where I failed with vrweb :( ).
>
> i figure a package like vrweb won't take too much support from now on
> anyway. i'll be able to handle it.

Until the next libstdc++ transition ;) Hopefully, this time, there are a
standard.

>
> > That's mean following at least the debian-devel-announce mailing
> > list (really low volume), update your package when new version
> > on the dependencies appears, answer to bugs reports, give some
> > (limited) support to users who ask you, and ensure that your package
> > still follow the current Policy.
>
> to answer thos: - have been following -devel for the last month. -
> will check the web page from time to time for new version. - bring on
> the bugs! - will listen on the weekly news for those changes.

Well, you catch quickly ;)

>
> > Finally, one little warning: As a Debian Maintainer, you'll be given
> > a new e-mail address @debian.org and some accounts on different
> > machines around the world. Does machine and bandwidth are given by
> > donators to Debian absolutely free of charge. Don't abuse those
> > gifts and try to use it solely for Debian-related purposes. It's not
> > mandatory but some maintainers have seen there rights as maintainer
> > remove already in the past for such things and we don't want to be
> > seen as a bunch of donators' abusers (sorry, can explain it more
> > clearly).
>
> i hope to use the @debian.org to get a job, especially while i'm in
> transition from university to home to university to working-world. if
> i do use it, it'll be _really_ low volume, as a backup email address
> so i can then tell people my new/current email address.

You can even used it as your default e-mail address, lots of maintainer
do it. E-mail aren't often the problem. Disk space and ftp bandwidth
are, especially when people used it to distributed warez. Debian is for
Free Software but not of this kind ;)

So I wait for your patches, check it ASAP (sorry, I have to write down
a conference I'll give for next monday so I'll be quite busy during the
next week or so; please, be patient) and upload it to master. I'll give
some feedbacks about it as soon as it done.

On your side, try to make your public key sign by one of the Debian
Maintainer in your region. You have to meet them in person with some
valid ID so they can said "Yes, this guy is really Paul Harris as he
pretended to be." It's important to preserve the integrety of the key
ring.

>
> > Voila!
>
> looks like we are done :)
>
> "If you can't make it good, make it look good." Bill Gates, 1995
>
> Debian GNU/Linux: We make good, and we make it look good.

... whatever your taste!

Regards,

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fabien Ninoles        Chevalier servant de la Dame Catherine des Rosiers
aka Corbeau aka le Veneur Gris               Debian GNU/Linux maintainer
E-mail:                                                    fab@tzone.org
WebPage:                                    http://www.tzone.org/~fabien
RSA PGP KEY [E3723845]: 1C C1 4F A6 EE E5 4D 99  4F 80 2D 2D 1F 85 C1 70
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reply to: