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Re: forks, derivatives, other distros - what are you thinking/doing



On Wed, 05 Nov 2014 09:32:57 -0500, Miles Fidelman wrote:


> If you're unhappy with systemd (and it's associated ecosystem), and/or
> with the directions that it's taking Debian (and/or large portions of
> the Linux ecosystem):

I don't actually know how unhappy I am with systemd.  I do know it seems 
to be causing a lot of churn in Linux, and I don't much like churn.  I'm 
a bit inclined to try and sit it out until things stabilize.  My server 
is sitting on the shore by using wheezy, but having jessie on my laptop 
puts me in the rapids.

> 1. What are your issues, reasons for doing so - general and/or specific?

I've had trouble with passwords in the network-manager starting a few 
months ago.  I tried a few other wifi connectivity tools, and ended up 
with wicd.  What was different about wicd was that (i) it worked, and 
(ii) it was independent of systemd.  I don't know whether the 
introduction of expansion of systemd had anything to do with my problems.

I've started to have trouble mounting the NTFS partition on my machine 
from Linux.  No problem doing this in Windows, of course.  I used to be 
able to mount it from the file manager after entering the root 
password.  Starting a month or so ago, the file manager would 
tantalizingly show me the partition but refuse to let me mount it because 
I didn't have the proveleges.  Finally, it stopped even showing me that 
partition.  Of course I cann still log in as root and mount it from the 
command line, copy any files from it, and chown them to myself.  But it 
is unnecessarily awkward.  I understand systemd had involved itselg with 
permissions.  Could this be relevant?  I have the same problem with usb 
sticks -- having to be root to use them.  Again, I have no idea whether 
the architecture changes caused by systemd has any relevance to this, but 
the general level of paranoia that is starting to exist makes me 
suspicious, perhaps unjustly.

> 2. What are you considering, evaluating, or otherwise thinking about?

What I've done is removed systemd from my system, though I still have 
systemd-shim and libsystemd0,  and systemd and libsystemd-login0 are 
absennt but still configured.  Still, although systemd-shim is not 
systemd, it serves to accomodate other system components that have been 
addapted to systemd, and so systemd still has indirect influence on my 
system.

I never use the current gnome anyway, and I've already replaced gdm with 
lightdm, so dumping systemd wasn't a really big deal. 

I plan to wait out the chaos with or without systemd until things settle 
down.  Who knows?  Maybe systemd will actually work reliably someday!
There may be some apparent settling down as jessie enters code-freeze and 
becomes stable.  I do worry about testing going much crazier than usual 
after it spawns a stable jessie next year.

Of course if systemd continues to execresce into the rest of the system, 
it will be a long wait.

If the siuation becomes intolerable, I may switch to one of the BSD 
kernels, or another distro entirely, such as funtoo, gentoo, or back to 
the slackware that I started using Linux with more than a decade ago, 
back when it was distributed on a CD but the installation instructions 
still told me to use floppy disks.  Remember those days?

> 3.What other options/initiatives are you aware of that you've discarded 
or
> otherwise are not considering, and why?

I'm not going back to Windows, OS/2, or DOS.  Except maybe in emulation 
for really ancient legacy applications, such as Zoombinis.

-- hendrik



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